Time  Nick           Message
11:11 luatic         what happens if i ask
11:12 characteristic be careful, you might get answers
11:12 luatic         i very often open things in new tabs because i want to keep the old tab around, and because it lets me load tabs in parallel
11:15 cheapie        I tend to open GH links in new tabs when using a slow computer and in the same tab on a faster one
11:16 cheapie        Like that 5950X box here at home can open them fast enough to be reasonably interactive, while on that C2D at work it makes more sense to open three or four tabs and come back in a minute when they've all loaded
12:04 Ingar          it's a microsoft product, someone is surprised it is slow ?
12:06 characteristic Ingar: i think more people are suprised that opening it in a new tab is faster than opening it in the current tab; you would think the whole “reload only the parts that need to be reloaded” thing would be faster than, well, reloading the whole thing
12:07 sfan5          personally I haven't noticed slowness with github. when I need to use it gitlab feels slower due to all the "let's use javascript to load this content afterwards"
12:08 characteristic surprisingly, using the program that was tailor-made for downloading and rendering web pages is faster than doing it yourself
12:09 user2_         takes me less than 5 seconds to load github... and i have ~2.5 MB/s internet (thanks to my DIY networking)
15:21 * cheapie      wonders if anyone has tried porting STNICCC2000 to a Luacontroller yet
15:26 MTDiscord      <et086> doesn't seem like something popular
15:27 cheapie        It's kind of a meme in the demoscene at this point
20:21 jonadab        I mean, with one port as network input and another as network output, it should theoretically be possible to implement a luacontroller TCP/IP stack, and that still leaves you two other ports for things like user input and display output...
20:21 cheapie        I suppose you could do that, but I/O is usually just done with digilines and those don't consume a port
20:22 jonadab        Hmm, I suppose.
20:22 jonadab        With digiline, you could _definitely_ do TCP/IP and user input and display output, and possibly additional peripherals as well.
20:22 cheapie        Although I have a demo sitting around on VE-C where I did implement a serial bus over two mesecons wires, no protocol on top of it though
20:24 cheapie        I implemented it as just a synchronous thing out of laziness, it is DDR though
20:25 jonadab        I mean, if people can implement Super Mario Brothers in flipping redstone, a luacontroller should be able to do more or less arbitrarily complex computing, if you have a sufficiently beefy system to run it on.
20:39 cheapie        I've already done a few demo-ish effects with them and the digistuff GPUs: https://cheapiesystems.com/media/2025-09-27%2011-46-30.webm
21:00 pgimeno        STNICCC 2000 is the new Bad Apple then? I wouldn't be too surprised to see Bad Apple in a LuaController. Tricky to keep it from heating up though.
21:03 pgimeno        But fans like those in the video might help ^.^
21:05 cheapie        I might need to do some stuff with DAS and the digistuff GPU and see about making a 256x256 or whatever video player
21:05 user2_         now run the original DOOM on a luacontroller- it can be ported to pretty much EVERYTHING
21:05 cheapie        user2_: I did a 3D engine once, never tried texture mapping though
21:06 pgimeno        enough to play Elite then :)
21:06 user2_         a 3D engine... within a 3D game engine...
21:06 user2_         o_O
21:06 cheapie        I would like to make a 2D (tile-based) platform game in it sometime, that should be relatively easy with the digistuff GPU
21:07 user2_         make a NES emulator
21:07 pgimeno        there's one for love2d
21:08 cheapie        I did consider making an emulator but not for that (not for any games, really)
21:08 pgimeno        a chip8 emulator would not be out of reach
21:08 cheapie        But an 8080 emulator would be fun, could then make a working model of the Altair 8800 in-game
21:09 pgimeno        I think there's also a GB one for love2d, so the CPU could maybe be reused
21:11 pgimeno        yeah, https://love2d.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=83803 https://love2d.org/forums/viewtopic.php?t=91383
21:31 erle           <user2_> a 3D engine... within a 3D game engine...
21:31 erle           user2_ the only thing you need to be able to do for that is raycast ;)
21:32 erle           look at my xcam mod for reference
21:32 erle           (it makes very slow back/white photos with software rendering)
21:37 user2_         woah
21:38 user2_         and implementing it in <10 KB too
21:39 erle           user2_ the trick is to understand how a raytracer is made
21:39 erle           user2_ basically, i have a rectangular “lens” through which i cast rays from an “eye” and then when it hits, i calculate the color of the hit. or, in the case of transparent materials, i cast another ray in the same direction. thus the underwater effect.
21:40 erle           user2_ obviously the raycasting function was never made for that and since this is just a tech demo i rely on a bunch of fakery
21:40 erle           user2_ for example, to get the proper illumination by the sun you have to get the sun angle. i just fake that. i could have proper textures too, but i just fake that!
21:41 erle           sun angle is actually quite easy to get since for the purposes of the sun and moon, time is a flat circle
21:42 erle           so i think you just need to divide the daytime by some constant
21:42 erle           i just never got around to it
21:43 erle           user2_ distance blur you can get by casting a bunch of rays for 1 pixel and then taking the average
21:44 erle           user2_ google “business card ray tracer” for people who have written something similar. it's an interesting thing to do to get a feel for stuff like that.
21:44 user2_         i know how a raytracer works...
21:44 erle           well then you will find the xcam source code most pleasing i guess
21:45 user2_         if i knew more lua, i probably would ;)
21:46 erle           btw anyone who wants to patch xcam to not hang the server, patches welcome. i tried thinking about some scheduling thing and making it a full-blown API mod that anyone could just integrate to snap a photo, but i don't have the energy really.
21:46 user2_         wait for SSCSM and hang the client instead
21:46 erle           (currently it hangs the server for as long as taking the photo takes, usually a few seconds, because it does the entire rendering in one server step)
21:50 * cheapie      looks back and forth between user2_ and a player elsewhere named User11
21:52 * user2_       finds that playername on a MT server
21:54 user2_         user2_ isn't my MT username however, i play as 'nub' on one of my primary servers lol
22:01 luatic         re raytracing, i have a basic raytracer in ~300 lines of go: https://github.com/appgurueu/codeguessing/blob/master/54/lets.go
22:02 user2_         i don't know go either... it looks like a mix of C and lua to me
22:35 luatic         user2_: that really captures the essence! i often call it a sort of "statically typed lua"
22:37 user2_         yeah using 'func' and 'nil' like lua, and {brackets} like C++
22:38 luatic         a C-like syntax, but you have GC, closures, panics; handling catchable errors is usually done using nil, x returns; interface polymorphism (but unlike lua, no duck typing), goroutines
22:38 user2_         anyway, i was about to ask if there is any easy way to cross-compile for x86/x86_64 linux on arm64 linux?
22:38 luatic         though implementing interfaces being implicit is as close to duck typing as statically typed languages get
22:39 luatic         user2_: oof, that i don't know, sorry
22:40 user2_         ;-;
22:42 user2_         i was also thinking about distributing RUN_IN_PLACE=TRUE builds for debian on arm64, they don't seem to be available anywhere without compiling it yourself
22:46 MTDiscord      <nathan4220776> To clarify, you want to compile minetest for linux on arm64?
22:46 MTDiscord      <nathan4220776> If so, then one possible way is to run an emulated ARM system.
22:47 MTDiscord      <nathan4220776> If you have dealt with ARM devices, then you'll probably know that it can be rather tricky to get ARM systems to boot, but the aarch64 version of debian was the least horrific experience for me.
22:47 user2_         no, i wanted to cross-compile ON arm64 FOR x86/x86_64
22:47 MTDiscord      <nathan4220776> Why would you want to do that?
22:47 user2_         AND i wanted to distribute arm64 builds
22:47 MTDiscord      <nathan4220776> Is it out of principle, or is there a real reason to do this?
22:48 user2_         mostly because i don't have a super powerful x86_64 PC
22:49 MTDiscord      <nathan4220776> Regardless, virtualization and/or emulation is probably the most straightforward way to do it, since once the system is set up, the compilation process is more or less identical.
22:49 MTDiscord      <nathan4220776> But you have a powerful ARM pc? ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)
22:49 user2_         my primary x86_64 PC is an old laptop motherboard with wires soldered to it-
22:50 user2_         my RPi5 is my primary PC, it can run 5.13 at 60FPS
22:50 user2_         and it's ARM64
22:50 MTDiscord      <nathan4220776> I see.
22:50 MTDiscord      <nathan4220776> For a moment, I was imagining that you were running one of those 96-core ARM CPUs.
22:50 user2_         i also have an ancient x86 PC from like 2005
22:51 MTDiscord      <nathan4220776> I see.
22:51 user2_         (i'm writing this on it rn, it's not much good for anything else tho)
22:52 MTDiscord      <nathan4220776> You could emulate an x86 system on the rpi.
22:52 MTDiscord      <nathan4220776> Though that would probably take away any performance improvements of using newer hardware.
22:52 user2_         yeah, i can run a whole windows 11 VM on it if i want
22:53 user2_         https://github.com/Botspot/bvm
22:53 user2_         it's a great waste of my precious disk space
22:54 user2_         and it can run arm64 AND x86_64 windows programs B-)
22:59 MTDiscord      <nathan4220776> Excellent.
23:17 user2_         merging https://github.com/luanti-org/luanti/pull/16535 will result in me not being able to say '<escape>(c@#<colour hex code>)text' to colourize stuff anymore :-(
23:18 user2_         that's probably a good thing...
23:23 cheapie        user2_: Just gotta turn that setting off, or convince the server owner to do so if it's not yours
23:23 user2_         yeah
23:23 cheapie        (and then I still won't see the colors, because I use a CSM to strip them on my end)
23:23 user2_         i have a CSM to easily make them on my end....
23:24 user2_         and who wants plain white text? :P
23:24 cheapie        me
23:24 cheapie        It's pretty old and not maintained all that well, but this is the CSM I use: https://cheapiesystems.com/git/chat6/
23:25 cheapie        Strips colors, does nickname coloring similar to HexChat (same algorithm, comes up with the same colors), and turns beerchat back into normal chat
23:28 user2_         mine is much simpler, i made it myself, i can colourize text,   i n s e r t   s p a c e s   b e t w e e n   l e t t e r s ,   user2@user2s_pc:~ $ echo "pretend to be a terminal, with proper colours", print the luanti/minetest/pre-release luanti ASCII art, and a few other things...
23:30 cheapie        That reminds me of some of the features of the yiffscript plugin I have here for HexChat
23:30 cheapie        (yes, I have a yiffscript installed, no, I'm not going to demonstrate it in here)
23:31 user2_         i don't use HexChat much, i run a local IRC client with my RPi3 downstairs and connect to it so i can save scrollback
23:33 cheapie        I run an instance of HexChat on each computer (or mIRC or IRCjr or whatever on computers that can't run HexChat) and they all connect to a ZNC instance
23:34 user2_         i use a random client i found and connect to it by going to 192.168.12.1:8080 on any web browser on my network ;)