Time Nick Message 00:53 Fixer more healthy offtopic 00:54 Fixer disabled antivirus, delayed start to worst offenders, boot time improved from 160 to 50 sec 01:00 red-001 #minetest-hub on-topic is [off] and offtopic is ontopic 01:00 roben1430 Disabled Windows, removed worst offenders. Boot time improved from 3 minutes to 10 seconds 01:09 Fixer .net is a bitch to start 01:10 Fixer infamous ATI CCC, slow as fuck since 2003 (iirc) 01:10 Fixer greenshot - advanced screenshoter, boot time like it is photoshop 01:25 IhrFussel max_lag can max decrease by 50% per 5 minutes right? I think someone said that 01:33 red-001 oooh the bugs got catchy names 03:05 * benrob0329 crashes hexchat with lua script 03:05 benrob0329 And all of Xorg apparently 03:26 shivajiva wb Shara 03:30 red-001 hi Shara 03:31 Shara Hi :) 03:36 benrob0329 Hello Shara 03:37 Shara I am so tired. But server was so broken. 03:37 Shara And apparently I can't sleep when server is broken. 04:08 shivajiva no excuse now :P 04:09 shivajiva oops wrong window :) 04:09 red-001 that explains the confusion 04:10 shivajiva nothing can explain the confusion red lol 05:54 * sofar goes to fix more shivajiva code 05:58 * sofar rebases 05:58 * sofar fixes conflicts 06:02 * sofar luachecks 10:58 Megaf Good morning 11:06 IhrFussel Hi guys 11:14 Megaf morning Fussel 11:22 Megaf Man, for days I've been trying to figure out how to make Linux dont use one VGA and use another instead 11:23 Megaf My integrated GPU had it's outputs burnt, now I wanted to use a PCI VGA 11:23 Megaf But I can't even make it send any output at all to the PCI VGA 11:23 Megaf and by PCI I meant it, the old PCI standard 11:25 IhrFussel So far I only see one entry where my avg_lag mod reports an average lag above 0.150 sec within hours ... very happy with this root server so far 11:31 Megaf IhrFussel: what do you mean by root server? 11:32 IhrFussel Root server can mean different things...in my case it's a VPS with dedicated CPU, so not really shared between all customers 11:33 IhrFussel Or let's say I "own" certain cores of that CPU when I need them 11:34 Megaf which one is your host? 11:35 IhrFussel https://www.netcup.eu/vserver/ << I have the RS 2000 11:37 IhrFussel It can't get much cheaper than that considering it mentions dedicated cores 11:39 Megaf That's great price 11:41 IhrFussel In the support forum I saw people running CS:GO servers on it and they say the performance is outstanding 11:43 IhrFussel So I thought if the product can handle CS:GO it sure as heck should be able to handle MT 11:44 Megaf FPS shooters dont require much power 11:44 IhrFussel But CS:GO runs with a MUCH higher tick rate (64 by default) 11:46 IhrFussel Or was it 66? Something between 60-70 ... also the hoster *promises* 99.9% availability per year which is 364.876957 days 11:49 Megaf Morning Fixer 11:51 IhrFussel Megaf, a FPS server has to calculate shots all the time plus collision... are you sure that's not demanding? 11:51 Megaf Well, you need a high clock yes, but not a lot of memory 11:51 Megaf nor disk space 11:51 Megaf and you are not running ABMs 11:53 IhrFussel True that...well the Xeon E5 "only" has 2.4 Ghz but I heard it can use turbo (not sure if my hoster supports that though) 11:53 Megaf I hosteI some WOLFET servers back in the day 11:54 Megaf and ArmyOps servers too 11:54 Megaf hosted* 11:54 Megaf Minetest is the most demaning game server I have ever hosted, seconded by OpenSim 11:55 Megaf And Minetest is only demanding because of it's experimental design (inefficient, but improving) 11:55 Megaf OpenSim runs 100s of scripts at the same time while managing 100s of players 11:55 Megaf still using less resourses than my MT server with 2 or 3 people and a couple of ABMs... 11:56 Megaf OpenSim is Mono/C# 11:56 Megaf there's no excuse really... 11:56 Megaf MT was very good in it's 0.3 version 11:57 Megaf man, I miss my OSGrid region. Now that I don't have MT server running in my VPS anymore I might put my OSGrid region back online 12:02 IhrFussel Sorry in case I spammed the chat with my relogs ... IRC is a bit weird when it comes to reconnecting after the ISP decided to switch your IP 12:03 Megaf did you read anything I wrote? 12:03 IhrFussel I just called my hoster and they said the turbo mode of the CPU will be used "Minetest is the most demaning game server I have ever hosted, seconded by OpenSim" << last message I received 12:08 Megaf IhrFussel: http://paste.debian.net/plain/1003588 12:09 Megaf you can just curl that 12:12 IhrFussel Yes like I already said recently: MT can run great on very fast hardware ... but it's definitely not good enough for older CPUs/specs anymore which is a shame 12:14 IhrFussel I mean you CAN play MT on a Celeron from 2003 ... with 20 FPS *after* you optimized everything in advanced settings 12:17 IhrFussel Even an AMD Opteron from 2010 struggles if you run a MT server on it ... the Intel Xeon E5 my current root server uses is from 2016 AFAIK and even THAT cannot stay on consistent 150ms ticks 12:19 IhrFussel We all know the main issue: Server thread only uses one single core of any machine 12:24 sfan5 IhrFussel: have they ever hosted minecraft? :P 12:25 sfan5 it's far more demanding 12:28 IhrFussel Yes in the support forum customers also report performance when running MC ... they say mostly the TPS stay at 20 12:31 IhrFussel With 10 players max_lag now is 0.3 ... okay I admit my server/mods aren't that lightweight but there is still a lot of room for improvement 12:31 IhrFussel engine-side* 12:33 IhrFussel I think MT would perform best on a CPU that is clocked at 3+ Ghz per core 12:39 Megaf MT is great for high clock CPUs yes 12:39 Megaf all MT needs is 2 threads running at very high clock rates 12:40 Megaf an AMD FX woul be great for MT 12:41 Megaf https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819113347 12:42 Megaf !title 12:42 MinetestBot Megaf: AMD FX-9590 Vishera 8-Core 4.7 GHz Socket AM3+ 220W FD9590FHHKWOF Desktop Processor - Black Edition - Newegg.com 12:42 Megaf Perfect CPU for Minetest ^ 12:42 Megaf IhrFussel: ^ 12:43 Megaf I think that's the highest clock x86 CPU we can buy 12:43 sfan5 AMD's FX series has terrible single core perf so that's not actually a good cpu for mt 12:43 IhrFussel 4.7 Ghz?? I thought CPUs would potentially burn after 4 Ghz 12:43 Megaf "8-core processor with 5.0 GHZ Max Turbo speed, and 4.7 GHz CPU base. Fully unlocked." 12:43 Megaf this one can go to 5 GHz 12:44 Megaf sfan5: at 5 GHz performance will be good for MT 12:45 sfan5 no 12:45 Megaf learned a new word today, dodeca. Means 12 12:45 Megaf dodeca core, 12 cores 12:46 IhrFussel Do you guys also have that problem with carts? Sometimes when you turn you are "stuck" for a few secs before you can drive further...I mean it's like the cart resets you a lot before it allows you to proceed 12:46 IhrFussel Maybe I can make a GIF one sec 12:47 Megaf ok, now talking truthly 12:47 Megaf https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819117792 12:47 Megaf !title 12:47 MinetestBot Megaf: Intel Core i7-7740X Kaby Lake-X Quad-Core 4.3 GHz LGA 2066 112W BX80677I77740X Desktop Processor - Newegg.com 12:47 Megaf that would run MT great 12:47 Megaf great single core performance, not many threads, just enough to run MT at full speed 12:48 Megaf sfan5: ^ 12:48 Megaf IhrFussel: another 4+ GHz CPU 12:48 sfan5 yes such a cpu would be better 12:49 Megaf that CPU with two cores and HT disabled, running at 5 GHz with a real time kernel, so sweet 12:49 sfan5 Megaf: an i3 with roughly the same price can deliver better single core perf than the FX https://www.cpubenchmark.net/compare.php?cmp[]=2014&cmp[]=2317 12:49 Megaf sfan5: I know, FX were terrible 12:49 Megaf I always disliked their architecture. reason I still have a Phenom II X4 12:50 Megaf any modern high clock Intel CPU will be good for MT 12:51 Megaf I'm quite found of i3s, they deliver good performance and are very cheap 12:51 Megaf https://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819117772 12:51 Megaf !titel 12:51 Megaf !title 12:51 MinetestBot Megaf: Intel Core i3-7350K Kaby Lake Dual-Core 4.2 GHz LGA 1151 60W BX80677I37350K Desktop Processor Intel HD Graphics 630 - Newegg.com 12:53 IhrFussel 10 MB GIF warning > http://94.16.121.151/mt2.gif 12:54 IhrFussel It's hard to capture it cause it only happens for a moment 12:54 Megaf 11 MB 12:54 IhrFussel And it's not lag max_lag was 0.2 there 12:55 IhrFussel It only happens at turns or when an obstacle appears ... it seems to fix itself faster when you turn the camera around 12:59 IhrFussel Here I was able to capture it better and in MP4 http://94.16.121.151/mt3.mp4 13:00 IhrFussel Again max_lag is 0.2 13:03 IhrFussel Plus it doesn't happen with the boost_cart mod last I checked 13:12 Fixer ah, """bestest""" european winter 13:20 nerzhul IhrFussel, i have a 8350 at 4.2 Ghz it rocks :D 13:20 nerzhul 8 cores, MT compiled in 25sec 13:33 Megaf nerzhul: 25 seconds :O 13:33 Megaf for minetestserver or minetest client? 13:33 Megaf Hello Mr_Pardison 13:33 Mr_Pardison o/ Megaf 13:33 Megaf !server Megaf 13:33 MinetestBot Megaf: Megaf Server V4.17 | mt.megaf.info:30003 | Clients: 0/10, 0/1 | Version: 0.4.17-Megaf / MegafXploreNext | Ping: 13ms 13:34 Megaf sfan5: what do you think about including uptime in that output? ^ 13:35 sfan5 sounds useful 13:35 Megaf Could you do that for us? Please? 13:39 nerzhul Megaf, both 13:40 Megaf Wow, I can't beat that 13:40 Megaf Maybe I can build minetestserver in 25 seconds 13:40 Megaf both, no way 13:40 Megaf only using ccache 13:41 Mr_Pardison Communism: you have 2 cows. You take care of them, but that government takes all the milk. 13:41 Mr_Pardison Capitalism: You have two cows. You sell one and buy a bull. You herd multiplies, and the economy grows. You sell them and retire on the income. 13:41 Mr_Pardison Enron Capitalism: You have two cows. You sell three of them to your brother-in-law , who then sells you all four cows back, which gives you five cows in the annual report which gives you a tax exemption for eight cows. But you're not aware of it at the time. 13:42 Megaf Brazil ^ 13:42 Megaf People and politians do that all the time 13:43 Megaf very efficient 13:43 Mr_Pardison they use mark-to-market accounting? 13:43 Megaf Sometimes it gets you in jail though, then you have to sell give away around 4 cows to buy freedom 13:44 Megaf s/sell give away/give away 13:50 Megaf *unplugs ethernet cable from switch 13:50 Megaf *gets angry when ssh doesnt connect 13:50 Megaf Me right now ^ 14:03 Megaf Welcome back Raven262 14:04 Raven262 thx Megaf 14:06 IhrFussel nerzhul, 8 cores are useless in MT 14:07 nerzhul IhrFussel, for compiling it's useful, i don't run server on my PC 14:07 IhrFussel It really only counts what *one* core can do 14:08 IhrFussel Yes for compiling every core can be used, but those minutes don't matter much as server owner 14:09 IhrFussel I wish we could at least split some tasks from the server thread into a new one 14:09 benrob0329 Lua threads! 14:09 Mr_Pardison sew! a needle pulling thread! 14:12 IhrFussel How about splitting ABMs into another thread? Would that make sense? 14:13 IhrFussel ABMs run pretty much independently right? 14:13 Megaf we just have to bundle this with our Lua http://lualanes.github.io/lanes/ 14:16 nerzhul no sense as the map is common and this will trigger many locks, it's not easy to split that 14:18 IhrFussel nerzhul, isn't there a way to just trigger the ABM thread whenever the usual server thread would trigger the ABMs? 14:20 IhrFussel And then the Server thread could do something non-critical until the ABM thread finished ... just a thought 14:33 rubenwardy ABMs need to be on the server thread as Lua 14:34 rubenwardy would be good to make Lua on a different thread, and communicate with a queue. Lots of things would need to be blocking however, namely the callbacks that affect inbuilt behaviour 14:34 rubenwardy heh 14:35 rubenwardy could maybe make our map storage multithreaded, achieve massive I/O 14:56 Megaf you can make Lua and SQLite very fast in MT 14:56 Megaf problem is, if the server crashes you are screwed 14:57 Mr_Pardison *helically wrapped around an inclined plane 14:57 Megaf there's some nice building options for Lua and SQLite that makes them totally async 14:57 Megaf [12:56:34] <Megaf> you can make Lua and SQLite very fast in MT 14:57 Megaf [12:56:45] <Megaf> problem is, if the server crashes you are screwed 14:57 rubenwardy sqlite is still limited by disk I/O 14:57 rubenwardy and you can't perform operations async 14:58 rubenwardy with a highly distributed map backend, you could read/write millions of nodes in seconds 14:58 rubenwardy source: I have a friend that did this for Minecraft 14:58 Megaf rubenwardy: https://sqlite.org/asyncvfs.html 14:59 rubenwardy ? 14:59 Megaf async module for sqlite? 14:59 rubenwardy how would you use that to set all water to lava? 14:59 rubenwardy that's what I meant by read/write 15:01 rubenwardy I mean, asking for this is too much given that entities aren't even stored in a simple constantly bounded spatial partition 15:01 rubenwardy they're stored in a list 15:01 rubenwardy what is optimisation again? 15:01 jas_ no clue 15:01 jas_ what's wrong with lists? 15:01 rubenwardy O(N^2) for collisions on entire set of loaded entities 15:02 jas_ a lot of whooshing going on around here 15:02 jas_ (seriously, heavy gusts!) 15:02 rubenwardy basically every entity needs to compare itself against all other entities for collisions 15:02 rubenwardy because they're all stored in one list 15:03 jas_ ouch 15:03 rubenwardy rather than a spartial partition, where they'd check all the entities in the same chunk, and then entities in neighbouring chunks if close enough to the border 15:03 jas_ i think spatial, i think AreaStore, which i like 15:03 jas_ that was very fast, iirc, so much so that areas was converted to use it 15:03 jas_ is it related somehow? 15:03 rubenwardy yeah, AreaStore is an API for spatial partitioning 15:04 jas_ too bad about the entities, i suspect the server gets slower the longer it's played, and the more entities are spawned -- if one is in a peculiar position, it could cause errors 15:06 jas_ oh i see your comment about AreaStore now, on this gh issue 15:09 Fixer quassel on start reads all my fonts, 2 second wasted, why? 15:10 jas_ because 15:11 benrob0329 Because Hexchat is better :P 15:11 jas_ weeeeeeeeeeeeeeechat 15:11 benrob0329 Actually I'm pondering an IRC client, you could do p2p VoIP using DCC :P 15:12 benrob0329 That is, if DCC worked in any modern clients anyways 15:12 jas_ https://www.reddit.com/r/Maine/comments/7o3vku/hannafids_last_night/ 15:14 benrob0329 jas_: weechat is good, but I got tired of having to constantly retype all autojoin channels just to change one 15:14 jas_ ? 15:14 jas_ i dunno about that, there's a script 15:14 jas_ plus u can use iset too, and alt-k it 15:14 jas_ but there's a script 15:14 jas_ just type /script, i gotta rescue my pizza 15:15 jas_ and search join or autojoin, i think the script is called autojoin 15:15 jas_ and don't forget go, that's great 15:15 * benrob0329 should write some lua for Hexchat 15:15 benrob0329 I tried last night for an [off] script but ended up crashing everything lol 15:15 jas_ there's a lua plugin for weechat 15:16 benrob0329 Ik 15:16 jas_ but the best plugin, for me, is the relay plugin 15:16 jas_ allowing me to access the box from an irc relay, or a weechat relay 15:19 jas_ well i guess the irc plugin is the most important 15:25 jas_ i burnt it a little bit 15:26 jas_ https://weechat.org/scripts/source/autojoin.py.html/ 15:27 jas_ but using /iset and alt+k works too, so u dont have to type a lot 15:48 benrob0329 o/ Krock, Wb sniper570 15:48 Krock o/ benrob0329 16:14 sniper570 \o benrob0329 16:19 Fixer /o\ 16:19 Mr_Pardison \o/ 16:42 IhrFussel My cars still suddenly stop at a certain speed... could it be caused by the send optimize distance?? I set that to 3 ... it is definitely not the HDD or RAM or CPU 16:42 Krock do they also stop when running into unloaded areas? 16:43 IhrFussel That never happens, the map loads too fast 16:43 IhrFussel One sec will make a MP4 16:46 IhrFussel Krock, http://94.16.121.151/mt4.mp4 16:47 IhrFussel Window may be a bit small 16:49 Krock that's indeed strange. Either it's the collision code that does weird stuff or the velocity is reset in the mod somehow due wrong calculations 16:51 IhrFussel It worked in 0.4.16 fine ... now the server is 0.4.17 and it broke I guess 16:52 IhrFussel But maybe it really is the block optimize send distance...I removed it and will see if it's fixed after restart 16:56 rubenwardy how does one get the kernel update to protect against meltdown? 16:56 rubenwardy can't see anything special looking in apt upgrade 16:57 sofar once I know, I'll let everyone know too 16:57 sofar lol 16:57 IhrFussel You just have to enable PTI (Page Table Isolation) AFAIK 16:58 IhrFussel If anyone got time, please check if the movement code here maybe has a bug https://pastebin.com/s4ETkJdS 17:01 IhrFussel rubenwardy, https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kernel_page-table_isolation ... as for OS update it will just be a regular security update by Debian/Ubuntu etc 17:02 IhrFussel The bad part is that they are not done with the patch yet (at least Ubuntu isn't) 17:04 IhrFussel Regarding Ubuntu they will update this page as soon as a patch has been released https://wiki.ubuntu.com/SecurityTeam/KnowledgeBase/SpectreAndMeltdown 17:06 IhrFussel "The original coordinated disclosure date was planned for January 9 and we have been driving toward that date to release fixes. Due to the early disclosure, we are trying to accelerate the release, but we don't yet have an earlier ETA when the updates will be released." 17:07 IhrFussel 2017 Nov 09: the Ubuntu Security team is notified by Intel under NDA << They had almost 2 MONTHS to fix this and aren't done yet 17:08 Mr_Pardison this affects all OS's. 17:09 IhrFussel Ubuntu specifies Spectre as "High" while they specify Meltdown as "Critical" ... IMO both are critical 17:09 * Mr_Pardison agrees 17:09 benrob0329 Ubuntu, the OS to rule no one but everyone seems to think they do. 17:17 IhrFussel benrob0329, that date apparently was the CRD for everyone if this article is right "there was a coordinated release date of January 9, 2018, agreed upon by essentially every operating system, hardware, and cloud vendor in the world." 17:17 Mr-Pardison makes sense. 17:18 Mr-Pardison release the patch at the same time so that it couldn't be exploited on a system that didn't have the patch. 17:19 IhrFussel I wonder if they would have kept it secret if the public wouldn't know about it until Jan 9 17:20 benrob0329 Probably 17:21 Mr-Pardison Fedora alerted me just now that important OS updates are available. 17:23 sofar are you kidding me? 17:23 sofar "<benrob0329> Probably" 17:23 sofar seriously? 17:24 sofar "there was a coordinated release date of January 9, 2018, agreed upon by essentially every operating system, hardware, and cloud vendor in the world." 17:24 sofar I mean, wat? 17:24 sofar how do you? 17:24 sofar even? 17:25 sofar http://s2.quickmeme.com/img/f7/f71beaed2b2a0d18a081fe28448c68ec43cc052c8c1539addfdaeede78e59800.jpg 17:25 benrob0329 Lol, I didn't say that keeping is secret until it was fixed was a bad thing 17:27 benrob0329 IhrFussel: [...] until Jan 9 17:27 IhrFussel I think there is a very good chance that no vendor/manufacturer etc would've said ANYTHING about the vulnerabilities if it wouldn't have been gone public 17:27 Megaf off, I shoud attach some wings to my two servers 17:27 Megaf they sound like they are about to take off 17:27 rubenwardy lol, offtopic by talking about minetest 17:27 rubenwardy gtfu 17:29 IhrFussel I mean we get security patches all the time and never really know what it was about (well you can read about many things that get patched but you don't see always all details) 18:47 IhrFussel I tried to compile 0.4.17 client and when I run it I get "2018-01-05 19:45:36: ERROR[AsyncWorker-0]: Execution of async base environment failed: Failed to load and run script from /usr/local/share/minetest/builtin/init.lua:" 18:48 IhrFussel Wait maybe I know what the problem is 19:07 IhrFussel Ok it's fixed ... but now I can confirm that the cars also stop in 0.4.17 client ... It could be something server side 19:07 Fixer *,,,,,,,* 19:09 IhrFussel Maybe a PR that was backported 19:09 Fixer sofar: btw not everyone will receive new update on Windows, since some AV shitware goes into BSOD, so it checks if you have outdated one and disables update, had to manually install it 19:09 Fixer security quality update one for Win7 19:09 sofar I don't windows 19:10 Fixer about that meltdown/spectre vulnderability 19:10 Fixer i decided to disable that Avast for now, to just feel if there is improvement in responsiveness 19:10 Fixer win7 is slow as hell on HDD 19:11 Fixer running ATI Control Centre and Greenshot apps written in .NET 2 and 4 literally rape my HDD 19:11 Fixer during boot 19:12 Fixer used delayed start on a lot of stuff, like Shype and torrents, boots in 50 sec now, year ago it was 300 sec 19:12 Fixer AV alone adds entire 1 minute to boot time, it is ridiculous 19:13 Fixer quassel went to delayed mode too, it is painfully slow to start, amazingly 19:14 Krock > literally rape 19:14 Fixer 4 sec to read a quassel database... it is not like 100gb in size, and it is not 386 cpu, WTF 19:15 Krock there can't be too much physical damage to a HDD by read/write cycles 19:15 Fixer it is just 256mb, lol 19:15 Fixer god damned 19:15 Krock symlink it to a ramdisk :P 19:16 Fixer it also wastes TWO seconds on reading all my /FONTS, WHY? 19:16 Fixer i only use 3 fonts at most 19:16 Fixer in quassel 19:17 Mr-Pardison g2g cya in a bit. 19:17 Fixer https://i.imgur.com/dx2stIu.png DANGEROUS 19:18 Krock use it. it's there for a reason 19:37 Fixer Krock: you like to live dangerously 19:39 Mr_Pardison Fixer: life is more fun that way :D 19:39 Krock not really. I just find it quite amusing that they documented such a parameter if people should better not use it 19:40 Fixer "16 dec 2014 - If you're using HDMI output with an Nvidia graphics card, you likely aren't getting full and accurate color range, specifically at the black and white ends of the spectrum." 19:40 Fixer o__________O 19:40 Fixer patch available 19:40 IhrFussel Stupid German media "Browsers are receiving patches against Meltdown & Spectre" That will fix NOTHING 19:41 Fixer it is like back to 90s 19:41 Krock but without gifs or 56k modems 19:41 Fixer https://pcmonitors.info/articles/correcting-hdmi-colour-on-nvidia-and-amd-gpus/ o.O 19:44 sofar IhrFussel: fixing browsers is critical 19:44 sofar since that is where you run untrusted code 19:45 red-001 huh I wonder how this affects luaJIT 19:45 IhrFussel sofar, the average joe is dumber than just visiting stranger websites 19:45 sofar oh sure don't patch your browser, you'll be better of for sure (said nobody ever) 19:46 sofar the dumber they are the more serious you should be about them updating their browser 19:46 IhrFussel There are many ways for those exploits to work... outside of browsers 19:48 sofar I guess you don't understand security defense strategies 19:48 sofar "Defense in depth" 19:50 IhrFussel I never said that patching browsers is wrong ... but if the German media reports it like THAT, some people might think that they are safe then 19:51 sofar most consumers will get OS patches automatically through Microsoft/Apple 19:51 IhrFussel Nobody can fix Spectre 100% right now 19:51 Fixer Keep your OS and programs up to date (except those that degrade over time), use adblocker, noscript, remove flash/java, done 19:51 sofar reminding them to patch their browser where they run random code from the internet as they surf german porn sites seems like a good idea 19:51 IhrFussel The fixes are mainly just for Meltdown 19:52 sofar "oh sure just postpone patching then" 19:53 sofar if anything it's amazing the press is trying to make sense of it all and tell users what they can do, right? 19:53 sofar I mean, it's almost like... they're doing what they should do 19:54 Mr_Pardison it's like one of those "FINALLY!" moments. 19:54 Fixer sofar: lol, yes 19:56 sofar here's an image of germans after they get instructions on how to patch their computer: https://i.imgur.com/nb0AsTE.jpg 19:56 Krock that's how native germans look like 19:57 sofar :) 19:57 sofar wait 19:57 Mr-Pardison >.< 19:57 sofar are you implying that there's "positive" germans? 19:57 sofar as a dutch person, I was not aware 19:58 red-001 can't get viruses if you burn your computer can you? 19:58 sofar just cancer 19:58 Krock no, that's bacteria that gets killed by heat 20:01 Fixer colorized 20:02 Fixer sofar: updating helps, it is just long legacy of WinCLF__K ecosystem with painful OS updating and absense of good update mechanism for programs itself 20:02 Fixer Nix systems are very good in this aspect 20:02 Fixer win ecosystem is minefield too 20:03 Fixer while they push store for now, i dislike the way they do it 20:03 Megaf That chat... ˆ^ˆ^ˆ^ˆ^ˆ^ 20:39 Calinou https://forum.minetest.net/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=19208 20:39 Calinou nice 20:39 red-001 yeah 20:39 Calinou I just reminded myself that Minetest's birthdate is October 10th 2010 20:40 Calinou …which is the same day on which My Little Pony: Friendship is Magic first aired, by the way 20:40 Calinou (:D) 20:40 Calinou or Ubuntu 10.10's release 20:41 red-001 wait those are 3 diffirent things? 20:49 benrob0329 Calinou: noice 20:50 rubenwardy ew 20:50 benrob0329 Ew? 20:52 red-001 ew 20:55 Calinou yes, Ubuntu 10.10 was a meh release 20:55 Krock Calinou, also minetest had a nyan cat with rainbow nodes. There's a pony with a rainbow tail. Illuminati confirmed 20:57 Calinou illumineighti! 21:01 Mr-Pardison g2g cya tomorrow peeps. 21:52 IhrFussel Is MT safe from a sudden shutdown? My hoster says they will now shutdown all systems for the CPU bugfixes but in waves, so I cannot know when my machine will be shutdown 21:53 Calinou [ 0.000000] Kernel/User page tables isolation: enabled 21:53 IhrFussel I mean is the map.sqlite safe then? 21:53 Calinou I booted the patched kernel from Fedora today 21:54 Calinou IhrFussel: SQLite doesn't like very much brutal shutdowns 21:54 red-001 ^ 21:54 Calinou so it's best to gracefully shut down your server before 21:54 Calinou (/shutdown or Ctrl+C once) 21:54 Calinou (or stopping the systemd service if you used that) 21:54 IhrFussel Not brutal, my hoster says they will send a regular shutdown signal which waits 300 secs for all processes to finish 21:55 IhrFussel Or to clean up 22:16 IhrFussel Calinou, I read that SQLite is *designed* to recover from any unexpected situations (OS crash, power failure etc) 22:18 Calinou IhrFussel: the best it can, yes 22:19 Calinou but it's not perfect at doing this, like any program 22:19 rubenwardy it'll probably be fine as long as you haven't changed sqlite_synchronous 22:20 IhrFussel I have no such setting in my conf 22:20 Calinou it's set to 2 by default (safest, but slowest) 22:20 Calinou 0 is the least safe, but can be much faster (sometimes 50 times faster) 22:20 Calinou you should use that one only if you have regular backups 22:21 Calinou (but you should use PostgreSQL anyway…) 23:09 red-001 it's just a frontend to lua loadstring/pcall combo 23:32 Megaf IhrFussel: I think no server has crashed more than mine in its 5 or 6 years of life 23:32 Megaf to this day, no map corruption 23:33 Megaf And I did change sqlite syncronous options to less safe options 23:34 Megaf well, everything else got currupted and I had to rebuild several times... 23:34 Megaf auth, players, homes, landmarks, world.mt, and so on... 23:35 Megaf but map.sqlite was always rock solid 23:36 Megaf The most often crash I had lately was OOM, seconded by indexing nil values, then maybe seg faults and no more disk space 23:36 Megaf all of them rather frustrating 23:57 Fixer reading about that meltdown/spectre thing, pretty neat stuff 23:57 Fixer the more you read - more creepy it gets 23:58 Fixer IhrFussel: you should check minetest db performance before/after that KPTI patch 23:58 Fixer https://github.com/HarsaroopDhillon/Meltdown who wants to try this? :D