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[MatrxMT] |
<Blockhead256> baguette best girl |
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| 03:12 |
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| 03:20 |
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| 03:39 |
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Confines joined #luanti |
| 03:39 |
Confines |
user333_ |
| 03:39 |
|
SFENCE joined #luanti |
| 03:39 |
Confines |
Thanks for tryna break our backend twin |
| 03:40 |
Confines |
By the way, before you say your "anticheat" catches cloakv4 users, the backend is used for Eclipse client also, which is a legit client |
| 03:41 |
Confines |
But creating an account with 2 million zeros as the username is lowkey genius, I'm lowkey mad at myself for forgetting input sanitization of all things |
| 03:41 |
user333_ |
hehe |
| 03:42 |
Confines |
You should join the team |
| 03:42 |
user333_ |
maybe i should |
| 03:42 |
Confines |
Do you use dc or nah |
| 03:42 |
user333_ |
just irc |
| 03:42 |
Confines |
Get dc on god |
| 03:42 |
Confines |
so much fun there |
| 03:42 |
user333_ |
also, did i actually crash your server- |
| 03:43 |
Confines |
Not sure if it was you or not cause we had 3 different ips screwing with our backend but someone did, the server it was on had very little free ram and it ran out of ram and segfaulted |
| 03:44 |
user333_ |
woah |
| 03:45 |
user333_ |
2 million zero username... it was 7 lines of python |
| 03:45 |
Confines |
Yeah, I was actually laughing my ass off when I saw it |
| 03:45 |
Confines |
Cause the backend was working after I restarted it but the admin panel wouldn't low |
| 03:45 |
Confines |
load* |
| 03:46 |
user333_ |
i was gonna register a username with a billion 0's but it gave a HTTP error for some reason |
| 03:46 |
Confines |
That is probably what crashed it, I definitely didn't have 1gb of free ram |
| 03:48 |
user333_ |
is it a VPS or a PC you own? |
| 03:50 |
Confines |
VPS |
| 03:51 |
Confines |
Everything that is publicly accessible is run on a VPS, private stuff like discord bots etc I run on a dedicated server at my house |
| 03:59 |
user333_ |
here's the script itself: https://paste.centos.org/view/06389637 |
| 03:59 |
user333_ |
(it was 9 lines of python) |
| 04:00 |
|
MTDiscord joined #luanti |
| 04:01 |
user333_ |
(the 3 IPs were me, my friend, and my friend on a VPN) |
| 04:01 |
Confines |
Neato! |
| 04:02 |
Confines |
You shoulda seen the script that was used on the luanti serverlist |
| 04:02 |
user333_ |
what was it written in? |
| 04:03 |
Confines |
Python |
| 04:03 |
user333_ |
ah, then i would probably understand it lol, i pretty much only know python |
| 04:03 |
Confines |
If you're interested you should learn golang, the syntax is similar to python and its a really good next step |
| 04:04 |
user333_ |
yeah, to me it looks like a mix of C++ and lua |
| 04:04 |
Confines |
I'd say more of a mix of C++ and python but yes absolutely, although imo lua is just dumbed down python |
| 04:05 |
user333_ |
yeah, i still have friends who believe "Lua > Python" |
| 04:05 |
Confines |
That is just about everyone in the luanti discord |
| 04:05 |
Confines |
I've seen that braindead take a few times |
| 04:06 |
Confines |
Anyway I've got to go to bed, lovely meeting you! I'll be interested to see if you fuck up my backend again |
| 04:06 |
repetitivestrain |
lua is faster than python and in minetest that's the only consideration of importance |
| 04:06 |
user333_ |
i'l try my best ;) |
| 04:06 |
repetitivestrain |
luajit, i mean |
| 04:06 |
Confines |
Found the brain dead take |
| 04:06 |
repetitivestrain |
you could never write e.g. mcl_levelgen in python |
| 04:07 |
MTDiscord |
<nathan4220776> Why not? |
| 04:07 |
repetitivestrain |
Python's far too slow |
| 04:07 |
user333_ |
no way :P |
| 04:07 |
MTDiscord |
<nathan4220776> That doesn't mean that it isn't doable. |
| 04:07 |
Confines |
Say you know nothing about optimization without saying you know nothing about optimization |
| 04:07 |
Confines |
I've written fairly complex real-time world gen in python before, it was fine |
| 04:07 |
MTDiscord |
<nathan4220776> Running the full GLM4.6 model on my own computer is slow, but I do it anyway. |
| 04:08 |
repetitivestrain |
Really? How complex was it? |
| 04:08 |
user333_ |
python is very fast (i think it was 3.10 or 3.11 that got a huge optimization) |
| 04:08 |
MTDiscord |
<nathan4220776> You don't always need realtime performance. ;) |
| 04:08 |
Noisytoot |
luajit has relatively limited architecture support |
| 04:08 |
Noisytoot |
like no ppc64le or loongarch64 support |
| 04:08 |
repetitivestrain |
I ported luajit to another architecture professionally |
| 04:08 |
repetitivestrain |
(sparc64) |
| 04:08 |
Confines |
I think it had 5 different maps for lakes, hills, cliffs, etc, plus a map for decorations |
| 04:08 |
repetitivestrain |
it's easily portable if you put your mind to it |
| 04:08 |
Confines |
I need to dig up the code this was years ago |
| 04:09 |
Confines |
Imagine wasting so much effort on luajit :< |
| 04:09 |
repetitivestrain |
was the perlin noise library implemented in Python? |
| 04:09 |
repetitivestrain |
or was it implemented in C? |
| 04:09 |
Noisytoot |
lua is not dumbed down python |
| 04:09 |
Confines |
Actually not sure, like most python libraries I'd assume it was in C, but I used simplex noise so idk |
| 04:09 |
Confines |
the library I used, opensimplex, is python only |
| 04:09 |
repetitivestrain |
luajit is easily ported to a completely new architecture by a moderately experienced C programmer within a period of five to six weeks |
| 04:10 |
MTDiscord |
<nathan4220776> It is dumbed-down but not in a good way. |
| 04:10 |
MTDiscord |
<nathan4220776> ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) |
| 04:10 |
repetitivestrain |
who understands the architecture in question, of course |
| 04:10 |
Noisytoot |
repetitivestrain: The difficult part appears to be getting upstream to accept your changes. The loongarch64 port was rejected and the PR closed without public explanation. |
| 04:10 |
user333_ |
Confines: so how much did i stir up in TeamAcedia with me crashing the backend? |
| 04:10 |
Noisytoot |
https://github.com/LuaJIT/LuaJIT/pull/875 |
| 04:11 |
repetitivestrain |
Upstream expects someone to offer them financial sponsorships before they will accept a new port |
| 04:11 |
Confines |
Me and the other owner were talking abt it while I was fixing it, honestly it was pretty fun fixing it, kinda gave me the same experience I get from finding new hacks |
| 04:11 |
MTDiscord |
<nathan4220776> Because china bad, of course. |
| 04:11 |
MTDiscord |
<nathan4220776> ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) |
| 04:11 |
repetitivestrain |
Not at all |
| 04:11 |
repetitivestrain |
anyway the sponsorship requirement is one reason our port is not being published |
| 04:11 |
[MatrxMT] |
<Andro (aka Archie)> lua is faster than python? |
| 04:11 |
Confines |
Maybe the other reason is that it isn't very good |
| 04:11 |
repetitivestrain |
Confines: well then that's scarcely a fair comparison, since mcl_levelgen must implement perlin and simplex noise in Lua |
| 04:12 |
user333_ |
i really expected a maximum username length limit on your server |
| 04:12 |
Confines |
Buddy, I just said the simplex noise which I used was implemented in python |
| 04:12 |
Noisytoot |
why not publish it anyway, without upstreaming? |
| 04:12 |
Confines |
I did too, thats what I get for coding at 3 am |
| 04:12 |
user333_ |
only 1AM here |
| 04:12 |
user333_ |
;) |
| 04:13 |
Confines |
I wrote that part of the backend at 4 am I think after work |
| 04:13 |
user333_ |
oof maybe do the important stuff earlier |
| 04:13 |
repetitivestrain |
Confines: then i simply don't believe you, unless your map generator is far simpler than mine |
| 04:13 |
repetitivestrain |
does it use 3d noise? |
| 04:13 |
|
SFENCE joined #luanti |
| 04:13 |
Confines |
user333_ that would have been a good idea |
| 04:13 |
repetitivestrain |
how many noises must be sampled per-mapchunk? |
| 04:13 |
repetitivestrain |
is there a spatial index-based biome system? |
| 04:14 |
user333_ |
well i got revenge on you for hacking the serverlist ig |
| 04:14 |
|
MTDiscord joined #luanti |
| 04:14 |
Confines |
repetitivestrain I don't think it was as complex as level gen for sure, but optimization is pretty easy and if you're good at it then you definitely could've implemented real time world gen equally or more complex in python |
| 04:15 |
Confines |
user333_ Why would you want revenge for such a fun and exciting event |
| 04:15 |
Confines |
server list hack was peak minetest icl |
| 04:16 |
user333_ |
why not :P |
| 04:16 |
MTDiscord |
<nathan4220776> Nah, peak minetest was mineclonia back when egaps gave a massive speed boost. |
| 04:17 |
repetitivestrain |
Confines: you actually cannot, since there comes a point when interpreted languages themselves become unsuitable for workloads requiring large volumes of data. for purposes of benchmarking, i implemented the same terrain generator in C and Lua, and the Lua version performed within 5-6x of the version in C, and even then required a few hundred milliseconds to produce a single 80x384x80 MapChunk |
| 04:17 |
Confines |
user333_ Because you could instead join in |
| 04:17 |
repetitivestrain |
anything longer than a second is unplayable in minetest |
| 04:17 |
Noisytoot |
peak minetest was when it didn't require shaders so it was actually reasonably performant on a ThinkPad X200 (this is why I'm still on 5.9.1) |
| 04:17 |
user333_ |
i'd love to join your dc... but i have dc, i just can't use it for MT-related stuff :P |
| 04:17 |
Confines |
Sorry but if you think that amount of speed is unachievable in python then you either don't know python very well or you are running it on a 250mhz cpu |
| 04:18 |
Confines |
user333_ can you create an alt for mt purposes |
| 04:18 |
MTDiscord |
<adrian530> It's a rather interesting place |
| 04:18 |
MTDiscord |
<adrian530> You find some of the most unhinged stuff there |
| 04:18 |
Confines |
Hey adrian! |
| 04:18 |
repetitivestrain |
Confines: sampling 2.4 million density values from some twenty noises per-chunk is a far cry from sampling 6400 in a 2d noise-based terrain generator |
| 04:18 |
user333_ |
nah, just start your own IRC channel .-. |
| 04:18 |
MTDiscord |
<adrian530> Hi prounce |
| 04:19 |
user333_ |
oh wait... Confines is Prounce? |
| 04:19 |
repetitivestrain |
luajit can barely manage and python certainly cannot at all |
| 04:19 |
Confines |
@adrian we could add an IRC link |
| 04:19 |
MTDiscord |
<adrian530> Hold on |
| 04:19 |
MTDiscord |
<nathan4220776> There is also cython, and/or other methods of compiling python. |
| 04:19 |
MTDiscord |
<adrian530> Confines are u prounce |
| 04:19 |
Confines |
Yes |
| 04:19 |
MTDiscord |
<nathan4220776> Python isn't exclusively interpreted. |
| 04:19 |
MTDiscord |
<adrian530> I got confused for a moment |
| 04:19 |
user333_ |
ah, i was on your anarchy server and met you there :P |
| 04:19 |
repetitivestrain |
pypy is roughly half as fast as luajit as a rule of thumb |
| 04:20 |
repetitivestrain |
the python to c transpiler whose name i don't recall is not practical and boxes values |
| 04:20 |
Confines |
Pypy is slow as fuck lmao |
| 04:20 |
MTDiscord |
<adrian530> User333 are u erle/ælla |
| 04:20 |
user333_ |
no |
| 04:20 |
Confines |
Anyway I'm clearly not gonna convince you otherwise, it is hard to convince someone they are wrong, and I need to sleep |
| 04:20 |
MTDiscord |
<nathan4220776> Were you granted a new cakehole? |
| 04:20 |
MTDiscord |
<adrian530> Damnit i almost guesses |
| 04:20 |
Confines |
user333 I remember that |
| 04:21 |
user333_ |
i was known on your anarchy server for a short while as 'hackz' :P |
| 04:21 |
MTDiscord |
<adrian530> Guessed* |
| 04:21 |
repetitivestrain |
Confines: well, i want to ask you, have you spent hours upon hours reading jit trace logs and assembler listings in order to persuade luajit to generate satisfactory code? |
| 04:21 |
Confines |
I kinda like IRC, it has a neat feature where you can easily ban evade without creating new accounts, might be worth researching |
| 04:22 |
Confines |
repetitivestrain no, I did not waste days of my life on a lua compiler, because I like to work on things that actually matter |
| 04:22 |
MTDiscord |
<nathan4220776> ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) |
| 04:22 |
user333_ |
and no subscriptions and ads like dc |
| 04:22 |
MTDiscord |
<nathan4220776> But yes. IRC is usually better than discord. |
| 04:22 |
Confines |
I use a modified discord client, no ads or subscriptions for me! |
| 04:22 |
MTDiscord |
<nathan4220776> No ads for me. |
| 04:22 |
MTDiscord |
<adrian530> Yall get ads on discord? |
| 04:23 |
user333_ |
IRC is also much older... from like 1990 instead of mid-2010s or whenever |
| 04:23 |
MTDiscord |
<nathan4220776> And you can work around most restrictions without nitro anyway. |
| 04:23 |
Confines |
He means the ones you can get if you want the coins |
| 04:23 |
Noisytoot |
IRC is great, discord is proprietary malware |
| 04:23 |
Confines |
IRC is an unc |
| 04:23 |
MTDiscord |
<adrian530> Oh right |
| 04:23 |
Confines |
discord is not malware, its just as bad as every other app |
| 04:23 |
user333_ |
correct |
| 04:23 |
Confines |
anyone who says it is just hates discord for no reason, probably because they can't figure it out |
| 04:23 |
Noisytoot |
not every other app |
| 04:23 |
user333_ |
same as the unwelcome MT fork for iOS |
| 04:24 |
Confines |
Oh I was gonna release Eclipse on iOS |
| 04:24 |
MTDiscord |
<adrian530> I kinda blame the uk for some of the bad stuff of discord |
| 04:24 |
MTDiscord |
<adrian530> I don't even have to elaborate i believe |
| 04:24 |
repetitivestrain |
Confines: interpreters are not capable of performing 471-800 million floating point operations within a few hundred msec, and if you believe luajit doesn't matter, why are you in this channel? python can never be suitable for luanti modding for this very reason. |
| 04:24 |
MTDiscord |
<adrian530> Btw prounce the ios builds for cloak are broken since a while ago |
| 04:25 |
MTDiscord |
<adrian530> I don't remember what broke them, prolly something stupid |
| 04:25 |
Confines |
I was in this channel to discuss some guy attacking our backend, you came along to brag about your jit compiler |
| 04:25 |
user333_ |
Confines: you can't release FOSS stuff on apple store because apple hates FOSS, you can make builds for iOS though |
| 04:25 |
Confines |
Yeah I noticed that, I think the image updated, an easy fix most likely |
| 04:25 |
Noisytoot |
hexchat doesn't ever demand my phone number or collect my data and try to guess my age and gender based on ML analysis of my messages |
| 04:25 |
MTDiscord |
<nathan4220776> It would be much better to have C++ mods that get "installed" as shared libraries. ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) |
| 04:25 |
Confines |
user333_ violating licenses goes BRRR |
| 04:25 |
repetitivestrain |
Confines: i don't care about your wretched backend, but i expect you to be able to read the group's motd |
| 04:25 |
repetitivestrain |
the channel's motd* |
| 04:25 |
Noisytoot |
maybe proprietary software users are used to this but it doesn't make it any better |
| 04:25 |
Confines |
I really don't care about the channel's motd |
| 04:26 |
repetitivestrain |
Then why are you here? |
| 04:26 |
MTDiscord |
<adrian530> Bro what's going on |
| 04:26 |
MTDiscord |
<nathan4220776> Why not? |
| 04:26 |
user333_ |
man some 14yo kid was able to crash luanti's biggest hacking group's backend |
| 04:26 |
user333_ |
aka me |
| 04:26 |
MTDiscord |
<nathan4220776> ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) |
| 04:26 |
Confines |
To discuss my backend getting attacked by a 14 yo kid, I just told you |
| 04:26 |
Confines |
I'm sorry you appear to have short-term memory loss |
| 04:26 |
MTDiscord |
<adrian530> Welp |
| 04:26 |
user333_ |
and a friend, who i will credit but not identify |
| 04:26 |
Confines |
user333_ just got 14% cooler |
| 04:26 |
user333_ |
yay |
| 04:27 |
MTDiscord |
<adrian530> I'm pretty darn sure that friend is erle/ælla |
| 04:27 |
user333_ |
nope |
| 04:27 |
MTDiscord |
<adrian530> I just know they have something to do with this |
| 04:27 |
user333_ |
they dont... i swear |
| 04:27 |
Confines |
They definitely do |
| 04:27 |
MTDiscord |
<adrian530> (Ælla If ur reading this ur cool) |
| 04:27 |
repetitivestrain |
Confines: if you are disinterested in luanti and luanti modding, which is naturally conducted in lua, as you confess, you're perfectly welcome and advised to remove your august presence from this channel |
| 04:27 |
Confines |
( Ælla If ur reading this adrian has a crush on you ) |
| 04:28 |
user333_ |
o_o |
| 04:28 |
MTDiscord |
<adrian530> ( no I have a crush on you prounce ) |
| 04:28 |
MTDiscord |
<nathan4220776> ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) |
| 04:28 |
Confines |
repetitivestrain I never said I was disinterested in minetest and its modding, I said I didn't care about a motd |
| 04:28 |
repetitivestrain |
otherwise it is entirely reasonable that i should expect you not to belabor ignorant untruths regarding the topic at hand |
| 04:28 |
repetitivestrain |
namely, luanti modding |
| 04:28 |
Confines |
Is it entirely reasonable to wish you had no hands to type with? |
| 04:28 |
user333_ |
ok... you should start your own IRC channel at this point |
| 04:28 |
MTDiscord |
<nathan4220776> august presence Is that a typo, or is that something that I've never heard of before? |
| 04:28 |
Noisytoot |
the latter |
| 04:28 |
Confines |
@adrian when you have time can you research how hard setting up an IRC bridge is? |
| 04:29 |
Confines |
The great and intelligent individual "Noisytoot" is here to share his wisdom! Listen up everyone! |
| 04:29 |
repetitivestrain |
Confines: then you ought to be well aware why it is not possible to implement a map generator of equal complexity to minecraft's in an interpreted language such as python is |
| 04:29 |
MTDiscord |
<adrian530> Sure ig |
| 04:29 |
repetitivestrain |
with playable results, that is |
| 04:29 |
MTDiscord |
<nathan4220776> It's entirely possible. It might just be slower. |
| 04:29 |
Confines |
https://github.com/BilHim/minecraft-world-generation |
| 04:29 |
Noisytoot |
https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/august#Adjective |
| 04:29 |
repetitivestrain |
Confines: slow, not as sophisticated as minecraft |
| 04:30 |
user333_ |
you can run MC world generation on a $1 microcontroller |
| 04:30 |
MTDiscord |
<adrian530> I estimate it would take between 5 to 10^4 minutes |
| 04:30 |
repetitivestrain |
user333: that's a grossly simplified version of the map generator |
| 04:30 |
Confines |
I think we need to spank repetitivestrain |
| 04:30 |
MTDiscord |
<nathan4220776> Minecraft-style* |
| 04:30 |
repetitivestrain |
it's not minecraft's map generator at all |
| 04:30 |
user333_ |
true, but it IS a map generator |
| 04:30 |
Confines |
Yeah |
| 04:30 |
repetitivestrain |
mcl_levelgen is a 1:1 recreation of minecraft's map generator and biome system that produces the same worlds from the same seeds |
| 04:30 |
repetitivestrain |
https://codeberg.org/mineclonia/mineclonia/src/commit/main/mods/MAPGEN/mcl_levelgen |
| 04:30 |
Confines |
No one cares bro |
| 04:30 |
MTDiscord |
<nathan4220776> ( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°) |
| 04:30 |
user333_ |
(/me assumes repetitivestrain watched the same video as user333_ ) |
| 04:30 |
repetitivestrain |
I do, because i have to write it |
| 04:31 |
Confines |
Of course this guy is using codeberg |
| 04:31 |
repetitivestrain |
And? |
| 04:31 |
Confines |
user333_ that video was fire |
| 04:31 |
user333_ |
i prefer github tbh |
| 04:31 |
MTDiscord |
<adrian530> Hold on thats kinda interesting |
| 04:31 |
repetitivestrain |
user333_: what video? |
| 04:31 |
Noisytoot |
github is proprietary and is not acceptable hosting for a free software project |
| 04:31 |
Confines |
You all fill a stereotype so well |
| 04:31 |
Confines |
fit* |
| 04:31 |
user333_ |
the one on MC server on a $1 microcontroller |
| 04:32 |
user333_ |
(i was there for the original content of that channel) |
| 04:32 |
Confines |
Nice |
| 04:32 |
Confines |
We'll try to set up an IRC channel for you soon user333_ |
| 04:32 |
repetitivestrain |
user333_: https://github.com/p2r3/bareiron/blob/main/src/worldgen.c |
| 04:32 |
Confines |
Probably link it to one of the public discussion channels in our server |
| 04:32 |
repetitivestrain |
this is all there is to their level generator |
| 04:33 |
user333_ |
repetitivestrain: still amazing it runs on a $1 microcontroller... |
| 04:33 |
Confines |
user333_ how have you not noticed that the only reason repetitive strain is here is to brag about coding the mcl world gen |
| 04:33 |
MTDiscord |
<nathan4220776> Imagine how well it would run on a $2 microcontroller! |
| 04:33 |
repetitivestrain |
user333_: well not really since there isn't even noise |
| 04:33 |
user333_ |
:O |
| 04:33 |
Confines |
He's here to get his ego refill before going to bed alone |
| 04:34 |
repetitivestrain |
Confines: i'm here because you are repeating untruths regarding python's suitability for various applications and how it is allegedly superior to lua |
| 04:34 |
user333_ |
i have an RPi Pico WH, it would be fun to run terrain generation on it |
| 04:34 |
repetitivestrain |
naturally i recently wrote a decent counterexample |
| 04:34 |
MTDiscord |
<nathan4220776> A lot of python libraries are written in C or a similar language. |
| 04:35 |
user333_ |
python has a much larger library of modules then lua |
| 04:35 |
repetitivestrain |
and hence i saw fit to mention it |
| 04:35 |
Noisytoot |
user333_: pico 2 would be faster |
| 04:35 |
MTDiscord |
<nathan4220776> In practice, depending on how the software is written, the performance difference between python and something else could either be negligible or orders of magnitude worse. |
| 04:35 |
Confines |
Well I'm bored of said discussion, you seem to think that writing some baseline code in C for the python to link to doesn't count, so obviously lua jit would be faster |
| 04:35 |
MTDiscord |
<nathan4220776> But saying that it would definitely be unusuably slow is just silly. |
| 04:35 |
user333_ |
like hashlib and requests which is all you need to crash a server B-) |
| 04:35 |
repetitivestrain |
Confines: here's the problem: luanti modding does *NOT* and will never support native code, whether in python or elsewhere |
| 04:36 |
Confines |
Well then you better go implement it |
| 04:36 |
repetitivestrain |
And it is intentional too |
| 04:36 |
repetitivestrain |
for reasons of security |
| 04:36 |
user333_ |
what about a C++ API to luanti which is compiled and run when you open the game |
| 04:36 |
Noisytoot |
repetitivestrain: you can load native libraries, you just have to use an insecure environment |
| 04:36 |
Confines |
I just modify the client |
| 04:36 |
Confines |
and add hacks |
| 04:36 |
Confines |
way more fun |
| 04:37 |
repetitivestrain |
Noisytoot: that's not countenanced by the core developers |
| 04:37 |
user333_ |
Confines: i have the HTTP API on my CSM API so i can crash your server from ingame :D |
| 04:37 |
Confines |
Anyway its actually bed time for me now, good night gentlemen, and goodnight ego strokers |
| 04:37 |
user333_ |
yeah it's 1:30 AM for me too... |
| 04:37 |
MTDiscord |
<nathan4220776> Not with that attitude! |
| 04:37 |
repetitivestrain |
and if it were otherwise i'd have written all of my luanti mods in c, which has the advantage of being a language i understand much better than lua, which is quite difficult and complicated in some respects |
| 04:37 |
Confines |
user333_ I mean that won't work anymore lol, but please do keep trying! |
| 04:37 |
user333_ |
allright, gn :P |
| 04:37 |
Confines |
gn |
| 04:38 |
user333_ |
repetitivestrain: now you can talk about world generation with nobody to bother you |
| 04:38 |
repetitivestrain |
user333_: you never replied |
| 04:38 |
repetitivestrain |
what video |
| 04:39 |
MTDiscord |
<adrian530> User333 would u kindly look for vulnerabilities so they can be patched :P |
| 04:39 |
user333_ |
uuuh- lemme find it, by the same guy that made that github repo |
| 04:40 |
repetitivestrain |
anyway i don't specifically want to treat of level generation, but only the incontrovertible fact that luajit performance is far superior to python's, and for that reason python is not fit for luanti modding |
| 04:40 |
user333_ |
i assume you stumbled upon the repo without watching the video it was featured in |
| 04:40 |
repetitivestrain |
i think it was posted to HN and forwarded to a telegram group |
| 04:40 |
repetitivestrain |
the repository, not the video |
| 04:41 |
user333_ |
here it is: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p-k5MPhBSjk |
| 04:43 |
repetitivestrain |
and i am not responsible for and neither do i accept the personal motives imputed by a fractious wretch who cannot abide being questioned by me, whose personal and recent experiences lead me to be skeptical of his statements |
| 04:43 |
repetitivestrain |
user333_: thanks |
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[MatrxMT] |
<twrightsman> pgimeno: for what it's worth, another Debian contributor narrowed down the issue to GCC 15. I see you guys are using 14 in CI, so maybe 32 bit builds may have an issue when you upgrade? |
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pgimeno_ |
twrightsman: Thanks for the heads-up. What's disconcerting is that it's calculating the sine and cosine of numbers which should have no problem, and returning NaN on them the first time. Not sure if it's a libgcc, libstdc++, libc6 or compiler problem. The latter seems unlikely, because gdb showed that function sincosf64 was being called, and that'd be the primary suspect. I'd say this is not an issue with upgrading, but an issue with a flawed version |
| 08:20 |
pgimeno_ |
that needs a fix ASAP. |
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| 09:26 |
MinetestBot |
[git] appgurueu -> luanti-org/luanti: Fix interpolating to identity bone overrides (#16609) 7331156 https://github.com/luanti-org/luanti/commit/7331156650292f95dad8eb67be8e7d111fb8aecc (2025-10-29T09:25:50Z) |
| 09:26 |
MinetestBot |
[git] appgurueu -> luanti-org/luanti: Fix wrong normal shading for objects (apply transform) 97c9f8f https://github.com/luanti-org/luanti/commit/97c9f8f709442cdb9b8661a41613dd1579ee3af2 (2025-10-29T09:26:38Z) |
| 09:29 |
MinetestBot |
[git] cx384 -> luanti-org/luanti: Fixes and improvements for item image animations (#16620) d4d3e10 https://github.com/luanti-org/luanti/commit/d4d3e10531a593cb161f68e2ece00961833fdcdc (2025-10-29T09:26:59Z) |
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| 11:03 |
[MatrxMT] |
<Blockhead256> Let me get this straight, so-and-so says he can make a faster mapgen in Python than so-and-so can in LuaJIT, then pleads that it's necessary to have some C code behind the Python? All while accusing the other of being a braggart while clearly demonstrating the qualities of one himself? Oh and he's a Discord user? Ladies, please form an orderly queue |
| 11:05 |
[MatrxMT] |
<Blockhead256> in less than 2 months I'm going to have to show some age verification if I want to use Discord or YouTube, probably even steam. Thanks eKaren. But I bet they won't restrict IRC |
| 11:06 |
repetitivestrain |
Blockhead256: ... Python ... Luajit ... haha yes |
| 11:06 |
repetitivestrain |
also Blockhead256: yeah, age verification is asinine |
| 11:06 |
repetitivestrain |
when the simple expedient could easily be implemented of obliging parents to |
| 11:06 |
repetitivestrain |
obliging parents to distance their children from electronics with which they aren't at ease* |
| 11:07 |
[MatrxMT] |
<Blockhead256> There's nothing that instigates libertarian feelings in my quite like threats to the free use of the internet. Facebook et al. are digital crack dealers, and parents are (allegedly) like "please government, make it mandatory to give ID to partake of the digital crack" |
| 11:07 |
[MatrxMT] |
<Blockhead256> *alleged parents are actually lazy, incompetent cops |
| 11:09 |
Gry |
uh yeah then it gets normal |
| 11:09 |
Gry |
then next geheration start to give id willingly |
| 11:09 |
Gry |
just like many do with date of birth |
| 11:10 |
Gry |
thats quite disappoibting |
| 11:10 |
[MatrxMT] |
<Blockhead256> buying at the bottle-o: show someone your ID, they don't care who you are, they forget you. Just signing into YouTube: Your ID goes into a database for cybercriminals to break into later |
| 11:11 |
Gry |
yeah |
| 11:41 |
sfan5 |
several governments have privacy-friendly technologies for proving your age online, entirely without needing a picture copy or even revealing your name FWIW |
| 11:42 |
[MatrxMT] |
<Blockhead256> that might just be the lesser evil, but not by much |
| 11:42 |
[MatrxMT] |
<Blockhead256> I just hope that that's the way things are done so much more often than the recent Qantas salesforce leak or Discord leak |
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bgstack15 |
BlockHead256: Yeah, I'm concerned about the way the www is going with all that privacy-invasive stuff. Irc is pretty nice and I hope the libera.chat folks don't decide to try to tie in to all that negative tech. |
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| 16:24 |
sfan5 |
aside from sorely needed better culling the next big thing for VE-C spawn performance improvement would be model LOD |
| 16:27 |
sfan5 |
there are so many vertices spent on rendering apples, office chairs, individual books in the shelf that - even if the were visible - only occupy like 100 pixels in the final image |
| 16:30 |
sfan5 |
112788 vertices for books I can't even see; 136488 vertices for eleven(!) 3d printers |
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MTDiscord |
<the4spaceconstants2181> 12408 per is a bit excessive |
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tsadok |
bgstack15: The Libera folks have already issued a statement saying, effectively, that they are not going down that path and have sought legal council and been advised that, for the time being at least, they also don't need to Geo-IP block the relevant jurisdictions and make everyone there go through a VPN to access the network, but that's what they'd end up doing if it came to it.. |
| 16:41 |
bgstack15 |
jonadab: alas, lawfully ignoring the silliness of the UK is not the same thing as avoiding the coming surveillance state of all tech must validate all users |
| 16:42 |
bgstack15 |
but I guess it does represent the start. |
| 16:47 |
jonadab |
Bear in mind too, that there's no such thing as really being 100% anonymous, it's just a question of how much trouble somebody has to go to (and how many warrants they need, etc.), to figure out who you are. |
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MTDiscord |
<et086> could they say in blocked regions "Please use a VPN to bypass your local laws" xD |
| 17:16 |
MTDiscord |
<et086> *so that we can bypass your local laws |
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jonadab |
Unnecessary. |
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jonadab |
Realistically, you would just firewall off the entire IP range of that country. |
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jonadab |
This is IRC we're talking about, people who use it, should know what Geo-IP blocking is and how to get around it. |
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